New Astra Militarum/Imperial Guard codex incoming

Gamesworkshop have announced that the next codex release will be the much anticipated Astra Militarum book for 8th edition. This will be available for pre-order next weekend, meaning that the actual release date should be Oct 7th.

Guard players should be aware that the bounty that this book will bring them does come at a price; at a minimum the currently popular massed conscript hordes will definitely be nerfed, but that’s very likely to be a good thing for the game in general.

The book will include 8 Regiments, each with its own doctrine, order, stratagem, relic, and warlord trait.

Regiments we currently have

  • Cadia
  • Catachan
  • Militarum Tempestus

Additional Regiments

  • Armageddon
  • Tallarn
  • Valhalla
  • Vostroya
  • Mordian Iron Guard

Warhammer Community:

“Codex: Astra Militarum is the next codex in line for Warhammer 40,000, and it’s just as packed with new content as its predecessors.

We’ve seen rules for Space Marine Chapters, Traitor Legions, forge worlds, and now there are rules for 8 regiments of the Astra Militarum. Which regiments, you ask? Cadia and Catachan will, of course, be included, as well as new rules for Armageddon, Tallarn, Valhalla, Vostroya, Mordian and the Militarum Tempestus. Each one of these factions will be getting its own regimental doctrine, order, stratagem, relic, and warlord trait – the codex is absolutely brimming with content, aimed at letting you customise your army to suit your style of play.

Similarly, the codex is set to diversify Astra Militarum lists with tweaks to rules and points aimed at putting each unit on an even footing. Conscripts, for example, have been changed to better reflect their inferior discipline compared to professional soldiers. It’s not just about rules, either – the new codex contains loads of new background and art, including a look at some of the more unusual regiments of the 41st Millennium and advice on how you might want to convert them.”

The WHC article included photos of 3 guardsmen, which have since been analyzed by some lunatic on /tg/ to show that these are definitely not new models, but conversions from existing kits*.



*lots of kits 😀

It will be interesting to see what they’ve done with the conscripts rules. “Conscripts… have been changed to better reflect their inferior discipline compared to professional soldiers” could mean they take a larger amount of casualties from their friendly local Commissar, require a successful dice roll to receive orders, aren’t able to follow orders at all, or can only follow a limited set of orders (losing FRFSRF for example).

We’ll soon find out, but speaking for myself I’ll be more than happy to see the blunting of the horde in exchange for a fully fledged and fleshed-out codex.

Bring on October 7th!

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63 responses to New Astra Militarum/Imperial Guard codex incoming

"Land Speeder Storm"

Yep, insane.

I'm curious to know if they jack the points of conscripts up to 4pts each, that'd make them much more balanced. Although we could read it as commissars aren't going to affect them or any sort of leadership based abilities/modifiers won't affect them either, and this would make them fluffy "yay for press ganged soldiers!' and much more inline with a 3 point costing. But I don't see that being a huge let down as you'll still see the horde bought along for first turn bubble wraps vs alpha strikes.

I'm excited for the Mordian Iron Guard who have been my favourite since I first saw the Imperial Guard way back in the late 90's.

This is just speculation, but I find a price increase unlikely.

If they were to be moved to 4pts, the cost of standard IG Infantry, they wouldn't also need to have a nerf to 'reflect their inferior discipline'. Making them less good at what they currently do (take up space, die, fall back and shoot) would be a better solution.

I am currently using them in my Guard army, but I'd replace them with more expensive infantry immediately if the rules allowed standard infantry to join up to make more a survivable unit.

I'm curious about the "more survivable" aspect of allowing units to join up – I'm just not sure how that works, exactly. Small units can more easily gain cover, ensure that any overkill is wasted, lessen the impact of falling back, can ride in transports, etc. The big advantages of large units would seem to be their efficiency in benefiting from Orders, and only taking one casualty from a Commissar.

Am I missing something important? Do the Commissar casualties spread across multiple units make that much of an impact that it outweighs all the survivability advantages of smaller units? Genuinely curious.

If Conscripts were no longer able to benefit from characters (Commissars, Orders etc), would they still have any advantage over the equivalent points of Guard infantry units?

Conscripts aren’t inherently more survivable then regular guardsmen. They have the same stats when you shoot them, but the size of the unit changes the screening effectiveness.

A 40 line sitting in front of your army protects a huge amount of frontage. When killed you get to choose where to remove them and therefor can maintain position of the unit wherever you need it. Lose 20 and the unit can still be in 2 places 20 inches apart and blocking up lanes. As long as you don’t move you can ignore coherence rules.

The much smaller 10 man guard units while just as tough (why the hell do conscripts have a 5+?) can’t block the same way. Only needing to clear the 10 that are actually in the way let’s players punch holes in the line easily and get their combat units in where they want them. It also makes it way easier to create situations where you can target characters.

They aren’t tougher. But the giant squads let you choose which die and that gives major board control.

"(why the hell do conscripts have a 5+?" because their training may be poor and their combat skills may be weak, but by the Emperor they are issued with Flak Armour guaranteed to stop even the most powerful heretical ordnance!

Lol. I love that explanation. And I know you are having fun, but I feel like a purpose built exoskeleton on a creature literally designed to fight in war wouldn’t offer 50% of the protection of some flak armour that a recent recruit put on…

See Termagant/Hormagaunt.

Also, how the hell can they afford all this gear, but still haven’t figured out that if Scions were in their Baneblades life would be better.

Termagents are only built over substandard materials that they had left when they were done building monolithic 70km long starships to get to the next planet. Still, they do okay, being largely superior to your average human in most regards.

Its proveable that over the years since their arrival in human space, the genetic material has weakened tyranids greatly (carnifex went from 3+ on 2d6 same as terminators to, only a 3+ now termies got 2+). I suspect that they are deeply concerned with their devolution due to reliance on such poor food sources and will mount one last great offensive to garner enough material to build an interglatic ship to get to a decent galaxy given how proveably rubbish this one is.

I don't think the conscripts are overpowered. People are just forgetting to bring anti infantry weapons. I always see SM players bringing the thoughest and best to take down tanks but never pay the same attention in their listbuilding to negotiate hords. I don't think conscripts need any nerfing.

@Kadeton I started typing an answer to your question on my phone during movie trailers, and then decided to turn it into a full article. Check the front page in 15 minutes 😀

It's going to be very interesting, I think it will be the first test to see if GW is going to try and fix the underlying problem that plagues the meta, or just respond to the perceived issue.

Conscripts I feel have a hard enough problem as it is in the -1 to hit meta, termagants and horrors just crucify them, its only when the smite battery sitting behind them, invulnerable to shooting, impossible to melee and able to ignore all the mechanics gets involved there's an issue.

Coupled with the ability to buy plasma for less than half the price space marines pay (13+throw your bolter away vs 6 and throw away your hotshot las) you have the real issue. With cheap anti heavy infantry firepower, super cheap smite batteries, and relatively cheap anti infantry firepower, it doesn't matter they have substandard meat shields.

95% of the models in the imp guard index are just so bad. Super Heavy tanks need love desperately, but we saw no change to land raider prices, just the release of a much better land raider.

Definitely looking forward to the Conscripts becoming "just another option", I refuse to run them but damn does that feel like I'm crippling my army as a result.

Hoping for some profile changes or cost rebalances on the Leman Russ variants to make them a bit more viable too.


It bugs me that GW constitutes to hype as “new” things that have been in the game for decades, such as the “new” regiments in this article… Games Workshop seems oddly reluctant to use the rich history of their games as an asset. Meanwhile, similarly geek-culture-targeting companies like Wizards of the Coast, Nintendo, Hasbro, DC Comics, and many more actively try to court the nostalgia crowd.

It shouldn’t be YouTube channels and fan blogs publishing “History of [Insert Faction Here]” videos and “Hey, remember [This Model From Yesteryear]?” articles. It should be GW themselves.

That’s weird. Skizm’s name and e-mail were in the message fields on my phone. The above comment came from me, not him.

I am Alpharius-ish.

Yeah but look at the balance in the Space Marine book, Raven Guard great, Ultras great, Salamanders great, other chapters get stuff too…..

I kinda hate the lol you painted your dudes yellow cos you liked it and now they suck aspect of things. I would be concerned we'll have the same issue with imp guard, but well, its already there and is no way it can be made worse.

Systematic bonuses should not be defined by chapter, or if they are, you should be fully allowed to go, yes, they are the Yellow submarines, a forgotten chapter of aquatic Ultramarines that like fists.

I invite you to guess which regiment will get the -1 to hit and infiltrate. My money is on the catachans sneaky jungle dudes, that will put conscripts on par with brimstones and termagents as soaky dudes.

Nostalgia (and the ability to blow silly amounts of money on models and not care) is why I play the game, nothing really changed, omg carnifexes suck, oh wait no, they just renamed it scythed hierodule, does exactly what it used to do. It is nice to be able to play without a stack of books being a cathedral and the quicksand pits were well, sand.

Unfortunately it also comes with a lot of experience, 90% of the enjoyment comes from list building and painting modelling narrative play is great fun, and leads to super close battles, but the point system and competetive balance makes X-Wing look like its been play tested for years.

There's a ton of things the forgeworld books that need errata or clarification like immediately.

Necrosius he Undying, is a Malignant Plaguecaster, that trades an extra mw on spells, for + to hit in fight phase aura and reroll DR on poxwalkers aura. Yes please that is amazing i'll have it! no wait let me convince you, you can have 2 extra W, 1 extra A +1 LD and know 3 spells not 2. He pays 10pts for this. 10 bloody points. +1 to hit aura?

Damocles Command Rhino

Has an interesting stipulation on its orbital bombardment

Roll a Dice.

You don't do anything with the dice, its outcome has no effect, but, you still gotta roll it. Pretty much everyone who reads it has an interpretation who knows what it is for.

Okay so thats FW but wait the main rule book:

My ynarri kill a unit of noise marines, giving soulburst, now what the bloody hell happens, its my go, so i get to decide order right? well this seems bloody dangerous, soul burst charge, k we out of los.

When they do errata its half assed

Sorcerous barge casts a spell can i try manifest it again NO! what if i cast the spell then the sorcerous barge tries to manifest it randomly….. … .nothing….. k gonna do it lolz.

Yeah, that's a pretty hilarious goof. And yet, no FAQ updates. They did a couple up-front, but there haven't been any changes in quite some time, despite a couple things like that which are clearly errors.

Sokar can carry primaris which is actually a game changer. It is already ludicrously effective, its clearly an ommission in the rules, cos it doesnt metion 2 times for gravis, but whilst the omission exists, it can carry all primaris infantry on a 1 for 1 basis and puts in the very top tier armies at the moment.

It would be my position that you can claim your yellow painted marines are ultramarines. Or raven guard. Or whatever. There is nothing in the core rules that prohibits that I'm aware of. In past editions, there have been sections on WYSIWYG, but that is notably absent in this edition. I thought there might be something about models needing to be "clear", but I can't seem to find it.

Obviously for play with friends, house rules apply.

For tournaments, what matters is what the organizers have decreed. I would personally advocate, for what it's worth (nothing, because I have no authority on this at all), that what makes sense is a "not confusing" or "clear" case.

For example:

1) If all your marines are painted the same, they must all be the same, but just because they're blue doesn't mean they have to be ultramarines so long as your list clearly states a chapter.

2) If you want to use DKoK [edit: models] with catachan rules because you think one looks good and the other looks stupid, I say go for it. Again, as long you're consistent.

3) If you want to make a bunch of orks and convert them like crazy to look like guard and play them as guard, like some people, go for it:

Again, you can keep going like this and it becomes problematic eventually if you take it all the way to:

4) Ok, so my melta guns are plasma guns, and my flamers are melta guns, and the guys with breacher charges actually have grenade launchers, and the company commander is actually a lord commissar, and the leman russ is actually a chimera, and ….

But what it comes down to is that tournament organizers can make a reasonable decision on these points (check with them in advance if in doubt).

And as for playing with friends, I had a buddy who once used a coke can as a Trygon. Whatever works.

Yeah! this is what i am all about, I do have a ton of armies, but to test raven guard stuff out i was using Dark Angels and Deathwing (Kayvaan was that assault dude from cassius kill squad)

But at the same time, a few weeks back i lost a game, because the tip of a primaris captain sword could see over the top of a castellum battlement and so the captain gunned down a stealer who was about to secure the objective (blowing stuff up). So in a way having the right model matters.

Sure. Thus the "modeling to advantage" rules you'll see in lots of tournaments, for instance see Nova's primer Section 2.2 about that:

BTW if there's a version of the official rules that were actually used at the tournament (and they differ from the primer), I would be interested in seeing it if someone can direct me.

At least there's no longer the imbalance there once was where you drew line of sight from your gun, but line of site was drawn to the body so you could be unshootable while still being able to fire. I'm pretty sure that was a thing in ages past.

They used the official rules, they just altered enough of the missions and cp stuff to make it very different from playing from the book, removed RNG made the game static, as you can see from mission goals, you require zero ability to take objectives, just need to murder your oppoenent over 5 turns and have them at the end. Its why Space marines have zero ability to compete, their win condition got removed.

…I'm not really sure what you're getting at with the 'murder your opponent over 5 turns' bit, or at least how that differs from BRB. All of the missions have some form of progressive scoring for holding objectives throughout the game. (While I can't comment 100% on how the pts for secondaries etc would pan out), I don't see just grabbing objectives T5+ going well for anyone.

And how does this differ from BRB? Remember, EW is a thing that consists of half of the Matched Play missions, and cares literally nothing about how you hold objectives until final turn.

The way space marines win games is scoring so heavily in the first few turns, whilst denying their opponents ability to score. They are hard hitting assault guys that can run in take an objective, but they go down under weight of numbers over time. But the way the "choose your win condition works" the marines no longer have their deny opponents scoring option.

There's no incentive to trade troops for objectives, you are better off choosing the win late and building an army to be resilient and have firepower.

You are totally right there's i think 4 missions BRB that follow the resilient+firepower win the game at the end method or by murdering your opponent, but that is balanced by the Maelstrom missions, which are about objective control from the first turn, and the ability to succeed to fulfil any objective. The armies that can consistently score supremacy and domination are much better, and if you sacrfiice a good portion of your army, but score them, you likely win.

With that balancing factor removed from tournaments like nova, space marines stand no chance, they are the best at forcing objectives but they are chronically and in long drawn out slug fests, they are just too damned expensive model for model.

*Looks at mission pack again* Oh, had missed the end of game primary option.
…Yeah, that's…hmm. Definitely see where you're coming from. Though, I think the idea is still that you score heavy enough early game to counteract late game – not sure how the points would work out on that, but it looks feasible if you're actually having that early game objective control. As long as they don't completely roll you…?

Can't say I like the idea, to be honest, but also can't say I've played 😛 . Here it's usually a maelstrom/EW mix (alternating missions so far, though 7th was often both per mission), though 8th hasn't fully shaken out, so that could well change.

I'm still hoping for an Armageddon campaign and new Steel Legion boxes to go with them. I used to collect them when I was in high school and couldn't afford the transports to make them proper steel legion.

It does explain their “Baby Ogryn” physiques, makes mêlée slightly more viable for them, and encourages the use of flamers, heavy flamers, and mortars, all of which are meant to be staples of Catachan regiments.

I get the Strength bonus but while Cats are often depicted as using a lot of flame weapons, never was it mentioned that said weapons were more effective than the run-of-the-mill IG flamers. And this affects plasma and battle cannons too, which… what?

The weapons aren’t better, the men operating them are more experienced with them and have better aim. It’s like the Raptors Space Marine Chapter: same boltguns as all the other Astartes, they’re just better trained at long-range shooting.

Mortars aren't vehicles so the heavy weapon teams carrying them get +1S rather than the reroll dice mechanic. Unless you're talking about heavier mortars on vehicles, which would, but the most common mortars ATM are the HWTs which get the +1S which basically does nothing for them.

Don't forget your big guns like baneblades (and variants), manticore, basilisks, etc.. Just run a Catachan tank detachment (maybe throw in Yarrick for 1 rerolls), pair that up with X other infantry detachment if there is a more useful infantry regimental bonus somewhere else, cheese ensues.

I mean, if all you want is rerolls and you're not just talking a single LoW detachment, Sgt. Harker is your man: same rerolls for catachans and just 38.5% of the cost.

The weird thing is that it doesn't buff Infantry with Flamers, Mortars, etc. It's only for Vehicles with "Blast" and "Template" Weapons. So they've got the best LRBT crews, but their line Infantry are no better with a Flamer than anyone else.

Squads of He-Man clones hiding in jungles, setting booby traps, whilst screening massed batteries of Griffons, Manticores, and Bassilisks… with flamethrower-equipped Scout Sentinels outflanking the enemy and Valkyries with massed rocket-pod salvos dropping hardened Veterans into the rear?

Looks like a Catachan Regiment to me.

Smells like victory.

Well now, the Mordian Iron Guard got a nice buff. +1 leadership and +1 to overwatch if they're in base to base, and +1 to overwatch on vehicles if they're within 3" of another Mordian vehicle. And Mordians have a unique order allowing them to target characters. Watch a plasma vet squad assassinate characters.

And there's a stratagem to allow a unit being charged to hit overwatch on a 5 or 6.

And there's the new Russ rule. A Russ can shoot its turret weapon twice if it moves less than half it's current maximum movement rate. Battle cannons don't look so bad now and the Punisher is going to mow down loads of infantry. Probably just exactly the buff the LR needed. You can even double tap demolisher cannons (how?).

Just the Leman Russ. That double tap rule is called Grinding Advance and belongs to the Russ (all variants). Other guard tanks have to find their own special rules.

Yeah i saw, but it means there are other buffs coming, they won't leave you even more in the hole if you pay for a super heavy tank. I wonder if they do it with strategies or with base changes?

Catachan Russes got a minor upgrade nothing too much, probably won't make any difference.

3.5 shots became 8.5.

My worry is, where will all the extra ammunition come from given that the imperium is losing manufacturing facilities across the sectors? Is this an indicator that we are truly in desperate times and there is one last desperate hope for a final hoorah?

Wait though, this just makes super heavy tanks even more garbage than they are right now? Omg it's gonna happen, super heavies will get re-roll to hit or 3+ BS. Which tbh is all I care about, leman russes are still not cool. Baneblades are cool, just rubbish.

Don't think the warlord trait's good enough is it? i dunno, I don't wanna pay for boots on the ground when i can drop plasma from space instead. I find vets rarely get to fire more than once unless they win the game when they do it.

What warlord trait? They didn't show any. The character assassination is a unique Mordian order, not a warlord trait. The overwatch on a 5 or 6 is a stratagem. If you mean the regimental doctrine, then a leadership buff and improved overwatch on all your infantry plus improved overwatch on all your tanks seems pretty cool to me. Probably not the strongest buff you could get, but still a useful buff that's going to see use in most games. Getting assaulted is pretty much the worst thing that can happen to guard, and anything to stop that happening is useful.

Was there an errata to the base Overwatch rules? Currently as written the Overwatch portion of the Mordian doctrine has zero effect.

Wow. I thought I was the only one who was this pedantic. I was making this exact point to my friend earlier that, even though codex rules override basic rules, "granting a modifier to overwatch" does not override the basic rule that "overwatch only hits on 6 irrespective of modifiers".

I think we all know what is intended by this rule, however, which is that this is a special modifier that DOES apply. I would expect clarification from GW and/or tournament organizers.

No sir, you are but one of many!

The 1st Pedantic Company of Imperial Guard was well known for it's referral to the rule book in so many engagements, that their opponents simply fled the field to go to the pub instead.

Is it really that pedantic to want a rule set that doesn’t require us to say, “The rules explicitly state ‘a’, but they obviously actually meant ‘b'”?

This case is pretty straight forward, there is not a lot of room to argue over what was meant. But we all know there are countless other examples where ‘a’ is ambiguous and/or ‘b’ has many possible interpretations. Rules should not require mind reading the devs, no matter how straight forward this particular case may be.

This is why I REALLY don't like that the devs keep saing that the rules are straightforward and easy to understand if applied as written. (They are doing this for both Sigmar and 40k, mostly in White Dwarf hype articles). Even if they DON'T believe this palpable untruth, if they repeat it enough, they'll start doing so.

It's almost like if you try to cut down the rulesset to a tiny handful of pages, and don't put any consideration into specificity of words, you run into problems!

It’s not a question of length, it’s a question of clarity. GW insists on writing their rulebooks in a prose/descriptive style, which does make them a lot easier to read than a more programming/prescriptive manner… IF 20 GOTO 10 isn’t exactly “fun” to read, but it is unambiguous.

I certainly don’t want Warhammer rules to turn into the telephone-book thick monstrosity of Starfleet Battles or Advanced Squad Leader, but would it really kill them to standardize their language and put key game mechanic terms into boldface or at least capitalize them? (Oh, and look up the word “wound” in a @&$#% thesaurus instead of using the same word to refer to fifty different concepts!)

-shrugs-. I agree, but if you aren't going to be incredibly careful about wording, making the primary goal of a ruleset being short is just going to cause problems.

And as I sa, they are continually claiming that the rules are completely unambigous if applied exactly as written, without seeming to acknowledge that what a game dev from Nottingham thinks a rule literally says is very different to what someone from America thinks it says, is very different to what the Italian translator thinks it says.

You certainly CAN have a short, tight rulesset. But going "Lets make this shorter" isnt' a good metric to use. "Lets make sure there's not rules we don't need" is fine, but "This sentence fragment makes sense to me, that's all it needs" is not.

Yeah it's a huge issue and that's before it's translated.There's also the nuance in languages to consider, if you aren't extremely clear what a rule means then it goes to hell when you translate it, i'd cite typhus for as a perfect example:

The destroyer hive always hits on a 5+ (even on over watch) the absolute translation of this rule, is he hits on 2 3 4 most the time, but in very certain circumstances (he has 3 psychic powers giving him -1 and he chooses to shoot a target predator that popped smoke, or he is killing a cullexus assassin) it still hits on a 5+

I don't know if this is the intent of his gun or not, it is a pretty deadly weapon if so, but because it doesn't say regardless of BS like Dark Reapers do he is horribly good vs infantry, far surpassing similar characters.

It's also not a Plague Weapon, which strikes me as bloody hilarious, it being the plagueiest weapon there ever was.

Because the rules are only consistent 99% of the time, every time you come to something like this confusion reigns, worse still (as i've mentioned before) are errata like the sorcerous barge, whereby it says if you use the barge you can't try to cast the same spell again, but, it doesn't say that if you cast the spell, the barge doesn't auto manifest it. The fact that you went to the effort to say one, and not the other, implies by omission, the auto manifested power is okay.

Who knows?

The points costs of things are so badly done, its impossible to work out from a balance perspective if something is just under costed, or the rules are meant to be different. Leman Russes just got their firepower more than doubled and their cost reduced, how on earth were they considered balanced before?

I think it's best to use the rules and point costs as a guideline and be ready to go, k that's just wrong (hi elysian sniper squad). I really wonder what the points/rules change will be on the Tyrannofex. In a direct comparison to a hell hound over 100pts less expensive it comes off extremely poorly, same with the tervigon.

Monoliths got a BS buff as they realised they'd made them total junk, but no WS buff on the big dumb tyranids don't get me started on Forge World models, its a total crap shoot if you get awesomely broken or pathetically useless. I paid £60 for a bunch of data sheets that i largely find i can't use because people go, well you gotta be kidding me, or i can't use cos its like trying to win games with half an army.

If you sell a product, make sure that product is finished maybe? and if it isn't finish it quickly, and for free.

Sorry i wasn't saying being pedantic is bad, I agree completely, thing is, it's not like this stuff isn't super easy to fix, but you have to admit you fucked up to do it, at some point when you have a 20 page errata, you have to start thinking maybe we should do a better job in the first place.

40k is never going to be balanced, latest codex wins will always be a thing, it's extremely hard to nerf the models someone just paid for, much easier to make the new stuff better.

If you go spend (cba to look it up) £20 on 3 elysian snipers, then find they get errata'd to cost twice as much, you have £20 of useless models. (actually in this case more fool you)

But it goes both ways, i bought the sokar to be cool and carry a batallion of space marines turns out the damn thing is hard to play with, cos its a bit on the overpowered side.

Nothing compared to the mistake i made with aetoas and magnus, bought simply to run around and turn people into chaos spawn, turns out that i was running one of the most broken armies in the game by accident (mitigated somewhat by my inclusion of thousand sons, cos it would be dumb not to have them with magnus). My fun army, is all but unplayable cos theres no real counter to it outside a min maxed tournament list.

The first army i played in 8th? Harlies, i always loved them, can't really play them in fun games either cos who wants to set up a board and deploy for an hour to play a game that lasts 45mins?

So i've done a great deal of research, and i am certain my death guard/nurgle army will be fun, good to play but decidely underpowered.

4th times the charm? i bet i get in game and morty wrecks everything.

Oh i thought it was a warlord trait, thats way better then, but i have to be those dudes right? so no plasma from space shooting chars (well unless they drop behind them, they do that a lot ~)

I think i am gonna not play these dudes ever though, i really like that tanks are people too though for guard.

Overwatch on 4's does change things, fit sounds great, but well, i think i still would rather not have my tanks close together. I think i'd rather take the firepower bonus from being Catachan than an all or nothing overwatch that means 2 tanks get locked in melee by 1 jump pack, ugh.

Its cool though! thematic! don't get me wrong, i love that they seem to be very friendly, hugging each other lots, probably cos the world got so scary, i'll read up on the fluff, but it isn't an advisable strategy against assault armies.